Identical twins, Bob and Al Murray are eighty-one. Their wives, Vera and Verna, also identical twins, are seventy-eight. They married as a group fifty-seven years ago in Leroy, Kansas, and today, retired from the grocery business, live on a beautiful spot overlooking the city of Topeka, Kansas. They had five children between them and have all lived in the same house together for fifty-seven years. Each twin has dressed identically throughout the marriage, and they wouldn't have it any other way.

"Well, we didn't start going together until 1933," says Al. "We all went to the same school in Leroy, Kansas, and we used to hang out with their brother. We knew who they were, but they were younger and didn't pay attention to us. But I guess we just took a liking to them. So Bob and me, we talked about it and we thought, ÔWell, they's city and we's country,' and you know, we didn't know if they'd want to go out with country kids, but we thought we'd call the girls and see about a date. So we flipped to see who called; we always flipped on everything. So I was supposed to call. And we didn't know 'em apart and we said, ÔWhoever I call, that's the one I deal with.' And Verna answered and it just went that way."

"And I guess I liked him, too," says Verna. "At the time we thought that it would just take too much trouble to try and figure out which one to go with."

"Well I never thought anything about it," says Bob. "I got Vera and that was that."

"And I never thought about trading Bob," says Vera. "It worked out pretty well, there were two of them and two of us, and it just made it handy."

"On our first date we went for a ride with them," smiles Verna.

"Yeah," remembers Al. "I called Verna while they's in town and we took 'em home."

"And it was real romantic," she giggles, "because they had a one-seated car and one of us had to sit on somebody's lap."

"We didn't like the girls because they was twins like us," explains Al. "Twins was the least part of it. In fact, there were several sets of twins in our small town--there still are--and everybody used to say that it was something in the water. We liked them because they had beautiful faces and they were nice."

"Ooohh, boy, listen to that," laughs Vera.

"Well you were," insists Al.

"That's sweet of you," says Vera.

"We could always tell the girls apart from the start," Al continues. "You can tell from their voices. But one time Bob and I did try and fool them. They had a swing on the porch at their mother's house, and we always used to sit in the same places, and one night it was dark and we switched places on them."

"Well we never had any trouble telling the men apart," says Vera. "Maybe sometimes from the back, or when you pass one of them, you don't know which one it is for a second, but Bob and Al are very different, though I could not tell you how. Could you, Verna?"

"No," her twin answers, "I know they're different, but I can't say how."

"When we were going to school, we didn't dress alike," says Bob. "We lived on a farm, and we didn't have any money, and dad would just buy us what was handy at the time. But then when we came to Topeka, we started dressing the same."

"And we always dressed alike," says Verna. "

We both had the same taste in clothes, though sometimes we'd take turns if one of us liked an outfit that the other didn't." "After we met them," explains Bob, "it was four years before we got married. It was the Depression, and we was trying to buy a grocery store, and we didn't have any money to afford to get married. But I knew that Vera was my choice, none of the other girls really interested me."

"And I always knew that Verna was my special one," adds Al. "As I recall, when we asked them to marry us, we were sitting on their mother's swing, and Bob and I asked them at the same time. I tell you, I was so scared I didn't know whether she said yes or no."

"And when you'd gone home that day," adds Verna, "I just didn't believe for sure you'd asked me."

"Anyway," continues Al, "after we was married we rented a house together, the four of us. People say it's unique, us living together, but we don't think anything of it. We've been doing it for fifty-seven years. We raised five children here between us. Me and Verna had two, and Vera and Bob had three."

"The children have been a real blessing in our lives," says Vera. "They're fine people. Course if they ever thought about doing something wrong, they knew they'd have had to face four parents!" she laughs. "Course that's just a joke."

"We don't think being twins is anything different," says Al, "though we do have a joke that sometimes it takes all four of us to say a sentence. But other people seem to think being twins is different. One time we were on Geraldo, but we didn't know what we were doing. We went there and the other people on the show--well we decided we didn't want to be on."

"See, the subject was different kinds of twins," explains Bob. "And there were two men twins dressed as women, one of them that was gay. Then there was a fellow there who had married each twin and then lived with their sister. I mean, it was a typical Geraldo show."

"But we didn't want to sit on the stage because we didn't really approve of those lifestyles," explains Vera. "And if we went, it would seem like we approved. They've asked us back, but we've refused. And it was really sad because Geraldo is really nice."

"There's one thing about being twins," says Al. "Sometimes it's hard for the spouse of the twin because twins like to be together so much, sometimes more than with their spouses. See, I like to be with Bob a lot, but because Verna and Vera are twins too, it works nicely, because we all have each other."

"And another thing with twins, "explains Bob, "is that sometimes there's jealousy between the twins, because maybe one is doing better than the other. But with us, the Murray twins, I think because we all had to work so hard together, we just didn't think about it."

"Well, we were all in the same boat," adds Vera. "Especially in hard times, if we needed something we all had to work for it. We couldn't depend on our folks to help us out."

"See, we ran our grocery together in Topeka for forty-seven years," says Bob. "Al and I usually worked at the store, and the girls were at home raising the children, though they did work with us sometimes and took turns being home.

"Since we retired, we spend most of our time working these eighteen acres we live on, and we volunteer for things at church. We walk almost every morning to keep active, and we play some dominoes."

"We're not trying to tell you everything's been perfect," says Al, "but I wouldn't have it any other way."

"Well just yesterday we had a tough day," explains Vera. "That's our hardship these days, the air-conditioning. It was hot, and the air-conditioning man was not here when he was supposed to be. Bob and Al were out digging up the yard, and we were ready to eat our dinner, and Al came in and said he couldn't find his glasses. We thought that this was just the final thing. Verna went down and she said, Lord, just show me the glasses. So she came out of the house and went past where they had been digging and found the glasses."

"I suppose in a way it's like one marriage," says Al, "but I can't say I know Vera as well as I know Verna. Vera is like a sister to me."

"And I don't think I know Al better than I know Bob," explains Vera. "I don't hang out with Al, he's a friend. The four of us all go together. We work together. I tell you what, though, Verna is our pie maker and our piecrust maker."

"And Bob likes to garden," says Al. "I don't. I cut weeds instead."

"Al took care of the meat at the grocery," says Bob.

"And Vera usually makes the bread," says Verna.

"We speak of it often," says Vera. "Sometimes we just sit here together and we talk about how fortunate it is that we are together."

"Yeah," says Bob, "you always got someone to sit on the porch with."